Comments

WONDERFUL!!! I ran a 360 room mixed-use hotel (with the idea of soon purchasing it) and what an amazing beautiful concept this would have been! I increased sales by 35% in 6 months by infusing a sense of pride in my managers and employees. I must admit that I wasn't always so loving! But we did manage to have some fun too!

How simple it would have been for me to give the managers and employees more of a reason to come to work instead of focusing on our customers and what they needed to do to improve this relationship. Loving on managers and employees sounds simple enough but how many of us really do this in a way that also produces stellar results? The latter may well take care of itself if the former is done right! I LOVE IT!

Trevor...I must add for your particular pleasure that sticks and boots are also not inherently bad. :-)

Posted by Judith Ellis at May 5, 2008 2:30 PM

I think you need both in equal measures. Imagine a director of a movie or play asking: Would you prefer to see a play where the actors and staff love their work or where management has made the audience its highest priority? Obvious answer: Both!

Posted by Tom Asacker at May 5, 2008 2:50 PM

I agree, Tom Asacker. Your "both" is the "right" to which I referred. I like your analogy. Pictures are always helpful.

Posted by Judith Ellis at May 5, 2008 3:04 PM

I remember TP saying many years ago ‘Customers will always come first … but staff must come even more first’ – I’ll buy that. It’s a no brainer for me – love your staff and they will respond – treat them like they are special and they will feel special. Carrots ALWAYS work better than sticks. And paying people more money is not usually the way to do it – all most of us need is genuine recognition. We all need to be loved. Thanks for the comment Judith –we have been here before and in the words of the song … ‘Ah yes … I remember it well’ …

I agree with you that Sticks and Boots are not inherently bad providing they are only used for Hockey and Walking respectively :-)

Posted by Trevor Gay at May 5, 2008 4:12 PM

Tom Peters.... It is difficult to recruit and to keep people who both love what they do AND fit comfortably within the prevailing revenue models of any business...

In a start up most people love what they are doing BUT they do not have the discipline of a revenue model (they have a burn rate of venture capital until it runs out or their revenue model kicks in - at that time some very talented people leave)...

In a mature business with a high profile brand it is easy to become robotic at work because the revenue models are dominant (the revenue models dictate behaviours, workplace cultures, risk taking opportunities, levels of experimentation, etc)....

For me some of the 'best fit' talent today are over worked, under paid, frustrated with 'the system' (ie administration's insistence on continual rounds of cost cutting), struggling to make a 'real difference' at work, etc. Yeah TP, you guessed it, they work within the 'health care industry' around the globe....

Richard

Posted by Richard Lipscombe at May 5, 2008 5:24 PM

Richard – I agree with the thrust of your comment but I don’t see the biggest problem in healthcare as ‘administration's insistence on continual rounds of cost cutting.’ The biggest problem I see is that too many healthcare managers don’t see a customer (patient) from one decade to the next. Too many managers spend their time writing reports that no-one reads instead of getting to the front line – listening to the front line workers and talking to patient and their families. The best leaders and managers in healthcare relate to front liners and patients because that is where they discover the truth about the service. There is simply no added value to patient care from those managers who write unintelligible jargon-filled reports that less than 1% of the workforce even begins to understand.

Posted by Trevor Gay at May 5, 2008 5:53 PM

Trevor... You are the health care expert so I defer to your knowledge and experience.. All I was saying is that the talent I see - not confined to the front liners but also surgeons and executives - is frustrated by 'the system' and in my experience it is largely one focussed on 'cost cutting'..

Again you are the expert BUT a lot of patients including me observe a moribund system of paper files and antiquated labour-based practices

Health care systems are a strange mix of 'state of the art technologies', paper shuffling, rework (bad procedures and practices that lead to bad outcomes of surgery and drug dispensations)...

Thankfully a new digital world is coming to a health care system near you and me!... It will use current digital technologies to streamline patient records and thus afford the patient far greater control over his/her health outcomes.. Patients will become health tourists and will travel to Asia for top quality interventionist health procedures (mainly elective but also for chronic illnesses).. This outsourcing of work to Asia by the patient not by the health care system will lead to huge numbers of job being lost in the current system and new ones opening up in the new system.. It is interesting that these obvious job losses/gains are not on most labour economists radar just yet - these job losses /gains (with their multiplier effects of say 5 to 1 will adversely/favourably impact some micro/local economies)...

Fewer people-based processes and almost no paperwork will fix many of the problems I see when I present with a health or wellness issue to any part of my health care system...

As I say Trevor you are the expert on health care system BUT "a lot of us simple folks who have to use these moribund health care systems would not defined the key issue the way you do"...

I love the front liners, especially in health care systems, they are truly great care givers and in my humble opinion they are the glue that is holding my national health care system together... BUT they are hardly the solution to all the health care systems problems... Nor are those patients who willingly accept (through their incapacitating illness or because they still defer to doctors and nurses) the 'sick role'....

I would suggest that the biggest problems in my national health care system are three - patients who blindly accept the 'sick role', labour-intensive processes that should be digital or automated (including robotics in operating theaters), and our failure to move on from this manufacturing model in health care that puts an emphasis on 'value adding' rather than a focus on 'use value' for patients...

My friend I trust you are well and do not have the need of a health care system any time soon...

Richard.

Posted by Richard Lipscombe at May 5, 2008 7:53 PM

Absolutely -- there is nothing worse than being at the receiving end of customer service where you just know the people providing the service are either faking it or worse, so unhappy in their job, they give appalling service. Good training and a focus on making staff happy must be at the heart of any good service organisation.

The sales guy who sold me my new phone in Carphone Warehouse on Thursday was a good example of getting great service because he loved his job. I was yet another customer in a busy store but he was really on the ball -- good service and he negotiated me a great deal with my service provider that exceeded my expectations. I had a great experience. I asked him if he enjoyed working for Carphone Warehouse. "I love it" he said, and he'd been there 8 years. This organisation are doing something right when it comes to employee satisfaction and retention. And that clearly translates to customer satisfaction and retention. If he'd hated the job and "faked" a good service, you can bet I wouldn't be wowing about my experience ...

Posted by Ian Sanders at May 6, 2008 1:41 AM

Ps
Yesterday, on a beautiful sunny Monday, a decorator was up at a ladder at our neighbour’s house. An old guy who’d decorated all his life.. and loved it (especially on a lovely sunny day by the coast). I said hi to him. He said he’d noted that the guttering on one side of the house was full of earth and moss so he’d put his ladder up and removed it for us. ‘Wow’ I said, ‘Thanks’.

Then he said that when he did that he noticed that one of the valleys at the front of the roof had some cement missing. ‘Oh dear’ I said, ‘thanks for spotting it’. He smiled. ‘So I fixed that too, just put some new cement in the gaps for you’.

I was stunned. He was decorating my neighbour’s house but had taken the time and trouble to look at our roof and fix it. I told him how grateful I was. ‘it was nothing much’ he shrugged.

I went back out to see him later in the afternoon and he mentioned some of our old window frames were in need of attention so I booked him to do some work for us in July. I don’t think it was a sales-technique; this guy was genuine in his goodwill in helping us out; but on the other hand, what a perfect way to introduce his great service to new clients? Not only did this work with us but he said he’s also decorating the neighbouring house on the other side, as his next job.

This isn’t quite the subject of Tom’s post but here is a One Man & His Ladder business, who obviously enjoys his job. He’s making sure he’s happy and it shows. And that’s why he won a new bit of business yesterday…..

Posted by Ian Sanders at May 6, 2008 1:54 AM

Carrot or Stick - I don't go with that debate. I believe in Love. Sometimes (the same as being a parent) that love has to be tough love (but it's still love it's always from the point of view of caring about that person). You have to care enough for that person to stretch them, to tell them when they are letting themselves down as well as praising.

When I think of it this way the carrot and/or the stick debate fades away.

Posted by PaulH at May 6, 2008 2:45 AM

Hi Richard – sorry to say ‘expert’ sits a wee bit uncomfortably on me but thanks for saying it anyway. I have been called many things in my healthcare career but never an ‘expert.’ I still have far more to learn than I know about healthcare – long service is not a qualification for expert status :-)

Your opinion on healthcare as a patient and your knowledge of organisations, management and business makes you just as much an expert as I will ever be. My late beloved Dad always told me to be wary of ‘experts.’

We actually agree on the ills of the healthcare business. My point – probably not made clearly enough - is about SOME managers who don't have a clue about what matters for patients and front line employees (Like you I too mean surgeons and executives) My real gripe is with managers who sit in their office, removed from reality and simply refuse to even contemplate that it might just be useful for to talk with patients and front liners at the patient/service interface. Ask any senior executive in healthcare who DOES MEET patients regularly whether they learn more by sitting in their office reading books and writing reports or by meeting the patient and/or families. That patient/front line insight (or lack of it) at the leadership level is the knub of the issue as far as I am concerned. The 'hardware' 'systems' and 'process' issues can be resolved very easily if the hearts and minds thing about patients and front line is won at the leadership level.

Ian two fabulous stories – thanks for sharing.

Paul – Wonderful! I am with all the way my friend. This is ALL about love and your ‘tough love’ expression is fabulous. ‘Tough love’ is still ‘love’ …. And ‘love’ in my eyes NEVER involves a ‘boot’ or a ‘stick.’ Using boots and sticks reminds me of the sign ‘If morale does not improve the sackings will continue’

I don’t understand why we don’t understand something so obvious

Posted by Trevor Gay at May 6, 2008 4:35 AM

"This isn’t quite the subject of Tom’s post but here is a One Man & His Ladder business, who obviously enjoys his job. He’s making sure he’s happy and it shows. And that’s why he won a new bit of business yesterday….."

Ian, not on point?
Perfectly on point!!

Guy hanging sheet rock for my wife's new studio on the farm--a real artist. His pickup's VT license plate: "HANGER 1"

How many "white collar guys" put their job description on their plates?

Posted by tom peters at May 6, 2008 6:56 AM

Tom, I'm surprised that I don't hear this fundamental issue discussed more: whether the route to customer satisfaction has to begin with employee satisfaction. It seems like a "yeah-of-course" but I can think of at least one company that has best-in-class service - resulting in fanatically devoted customers - that has an abusive culture, especially in its management ranks. Interesting paradox.

Posted by John O'Leary at May 6, 2008 8:13 AM

PaulH...my beautiful brilliant immensely strong mother of 5' 3" raised 12 children (all of ranging from 5' 5" to 6' 4") alone with a great combination of love and discipline with the "one man she loved next to God." Although my father was not around regularly (he too was a great man but with weaknesses), she NEVER bad mouthed him, nor did she EVER raise her voice in anger towards us...NOT ONCE! Regretfully, I cannot say the same about me. I have, however, without doubt mellowed with years and never did I ever seek to hurt or offend others.

My mother showed us an extraordinary amount of love and discipline too. She was the brightest most intelligent kindest most loving person I have ever known. Now ask me if when she spoke in soft tones if we ABSOLUTELY knew she meant business. WE DID! But I must admit that she did NOT spare the rod, spanking us...no WHIPPING us whenever she thought we had crossed noted boundaries. I must also admit to getting my fair share of whippings...believe me.

I do not wish to start an open debate about the physical or psychological effect of corporal punishment, rendered not only by my mom but by my aunts, and seniors of the church. (And beleive me NO ONE was just beating up on us. Her eye was keen and watchful, her perceptions near flawless. She was sharp!) I do, however, wish to express that even with this sort of discipline it was abundantly clear that her whipping us was as she often said "more painful to me than it is to you." I didn't believe her then, thinking this can't be so. But as I got older I could clearly see that she was speaking truthfully. She would actually speak to us in soft determined tones as she delivered each lash her face ever so slightly twitching. I hated those talks. But value them today.

All of my siblings are productive citizens. We are ministers, chaplains, and entreprenuers with multiple degrees. We are also trained musicians, artists, and lovers of people of every nationality and creed. We are world travelers. My mother, though imperfect, showed us an ABUNDANT amount of love, discipline, and kindness unmatched by that of anyone that I know. She was unselfish, but we respected her space. She guarded this too, teaching us to respect her space and each others and by extension others. Imagine this in a house of 12 children that are only a few years a part? From the oldest to the youngest there are 15 years between us. I'm the youngest.

Not only did my mom show great love to us, but to countless of others also. While we could not visit the homes of too many other kids unless she knew their parent well, our 7 bedroom house was ALWAYS full of other peoples kids. We were also expected to visit nursing homes, tutor others, and show other acts of kindness reguarly. "If you have two and your neighbor needs one, give it freely," she would say. We had great fun too! Being the cousin of Richard Pryor, she also had an amazing sense of humor. I miss her tremendously.

Posted by Judith Ellis at May 6, 2008 8:15 AM

Just finished a fantastic book on this topic "The three signs of a miserable job" by Patrick Lencioni. The book and this blog has had a big impact on me and my employees.

Posted by Joe at May 6, 2008 9:35 AM

"It seems like a "yeah-of-course" but I can think of at least one company that has best-in-class service - resulting in fanatically devoted customers - that has an abusive culture, especially in its management ranks. Interesting paradox."

Actually, John, this pleases me. While I think "we" are right, it's a big world out there and there are no 100% formulas when it comes to human behavior! (Except "respect," or "character," Jim Kouzes' "Credibility"? I believe one can respect a prick, no? Eg, Welch?)

Posted by tom peters at May 6, 2008 11:40 AM

Wow; fantastic conversation.

I think the question of whether to focus on staff or customer is much like golf: should I work on my game, or try for a low score? Obviously, one is the way to achieve the other.

Do I want clients to be delighted every single day? Delight-ed/-ful staff will domino the effect nicely. Passion is infectious. Infect your frontliners and they'll infect your clientele who'll infect prospects and suspects.

Posted by Joel D Canfield at May 6, 2008 11:41 AM

I don't know Mr. Welch personally, but I have come to find great value in respecting pricks. In so doing, I have also learned invaluable lessons about humility and advancement. Respecting pricks seems paramount to personal and corporate progress.

Posted by Judith Ellis at May 6, 2008 12:02 PM

Hearing Tom's story about the guy's licence plate reminds me of a success story here in London. London's "Pimlico Plumbers" are famous around town for their fleet of vans with distinctive licence plates. You often see the blue vans with licence plates such as B1 DET , LAV 1 , F1 USH , W4 TER , DRA 1N , S1 NKS and even BOG 1. This business clearly has a personality and wears it on its vans. When I needed a plumbing firm, I called Pimlico Plumbers and for this reason only. It's the best marketing they ever had.

Pimlico Plumbers are also the employer of one Buster Martin, AGED 101, who still works 5 days a week at the company (no kidding). Even more remarkable, he only started at the company 3 years ago because "he was bored"!!

That's two factors that give Pimlico Plumbers a real edge....

Posted by Ian Sanders at May 6, 2008 1:07 PM

We must take care of those that take care of our customers. I've been around the business world and have had the joy and the tears of working for people who care about their employees.

Here is a true store about one manager I worked with in a division of a large corporation. During my time at the company the management went from individual offices to cubicle nation. My cube faced the entrance so whenever my manager, Mr. L (I'll protect his identity) went to his office (he ranked non-cubicle space) he would have to pass by my cube and 3 fellow colleague's cubes before reaching his office.

Well, Mr. L would walk by every morning without acknowledging my existence, which I would usually shrug off as his vagrant disregard for women in the business world. But one morning after Mr. L's pass by my neighboring colleague, Mr. B., came into my cube. Mr. B was well known and respected in the industry and the company and was someone I looked to for guidance and business advice. He was a calm and levelheaded guy, but this one morning he was visually frustrated and down. He told me he had started to track (he was very analytical) how many times Mr. L would acknowledge him as he walked by his cube.

Twenty-Seven Days

Twenty-seven days had passed without a single "hello" from Mr. L. I could not believe what I was hearing. How could a manger walk by the people who worked with him for twenty-seven days and not stop once? I could rationalize Mr. L's on-going dismissal of my existence, but not Mr. B's. We talked for a long while about this and never really came to any resolution, but Mr. B continued to track the non-communicating manager.

I no longer work for Mr. L or the company, but that incident taught me a lot.

Posted by Charlene at May 6, 2008 1:17 PM

Sad story Charlene - thanks for sharing. Many of us unfortunately come across a Mr L. Your action was the best action well done – just leave. I disagree about respecting pricks. Mr L is the sort of person I think of when I think of a prick. I will respect a leader who is competent, strong and fair even if I don’t like them as a person but I will not respect a prick … sorry.

Posted by Trevor Gay at May 6, 2008 3:51 PM

It is undoubtedly not that you respect a prick's actions, but you can most certainly respect his (can women be pricks?)authority and often times immense talent. There are many ways to address all kinds of personality types. Respect is the starting point, even when the prick is not respectable.

Posted by Judith Ellis at May 6, 2008 5:23 PM

Hi Judith - yes women can be pricks - I worked with one. I have an open mind on most things but respecting a prick is a no go area for me.

Prick – ‘a spiteful or contemptible man (or woman) often having some authority’
Source: Merriam-Webster online dictionary

Zero respect -in fact negative respect from me for that type of person.

Posted by Trevor Gay at May 6, 2008 5:48 PM

So, what would your position be, Trevor? Ignore the prick? Openly put him/her in their place? Undermine his/her authority? If you're not respecting the prick in authority, what are your options? Besides the humility factor, respecting the prick in authority also means doing your very best in your position in spite of the prick by finding creative solutions. Would this show up a prick better than anything? There is also the option of leaving. But what work environment has a prick-free culture?

Posted by Judith Ellis at May 6, 2008 9:32 PM

High guest satisfaction is just a bit more complicated than employee satisfaction.

Posted by Tom H. C. Anderson at May 6, 2008 11:24 PM

In the 1960's, America sent men to the moon.
We were still looking for new frontiers. Now we get excited over good uniforms.
What is going on?
I've seen the future and he has a queer eye!

Posted by unclesam at May 6, 2008 11:51 PM

Hi Tom,

4 in the morning here in São Luis, Brazil and I can't keep my eyes closed...

Your post made me think of the excellent book by Ken Blanchard, "Customer Mania," in which he describes Yum's journey to become an first-class service provider. While reading it, I immediately started applying its principles in my business with immediate results.

It goes like this: maximizing guest enjoyment is the goal. It's the setup piece. It's the ultimate purpose of whatever you're doing.

How do you achieve it? By flipping the traditional hierarchy upside-down when it's time to execute. Literally, guests become employees' bosses and employees become managers' bosses and managers become investors'/owners' bosses.

Incidentally, this little principle solves, based on my experience, the famous execution dilemma that you've been ranting about for years and that Larry Bossidy and Ram Charan addressed in their book "Execution."

Goals flow top-down. Execution flows bottom-up.

Some of my business colleagues are amazed at how my employees boss me around when I'm on the service floor of our bakery. Because 90% of the time, either I'm in their way or I'm not equipping them with the tools/policies/autonomy/budget necessary to create a scintillating experience for our guests.

In no time, we've developed a matchless reputation for service in town. Even the neighboring restaurants don't know how we do it.

It's that simple. Flip the funnel around and get the f@$k out of the way. :)

Posted by Martin Messier at May 7, 2008 2:53 AM

Brilliant response Judith – thank you. I really enjoy our exchanges. You have a brilliant message to pass on and its great that you always respond. I love your comment – ‘But what work environment has a prick-free culture?’

I think we should definitely AIM for a ‘prick free zone’ and I fully realise I live in my own idealistic world. I prefer to call myself an idealistic realist:-) Tom Peters always uses this wonderful Michelangelo quote;

“The greatest danger for most of us is not that our aim is too high and we miss it, but that it is too low and we reach it”

A ‘Prick Free Zone’ among my managers would be one of my highest aims if I were a Chief Executive.

Posted by Trevor Gay at May 7, 2008 3:41 AM

Martin - that is an absolutely fantastic comment. You say it so much better than me. I’ve been saying - since Adam was a boy in fact - that front line workers know all the answers. The best leaders recognise that and just let workers get on with it. Your practical experience of ‘letting go’ is the same as mine. The best thing a leader can do is give away their perceived power and just let people get on with adding value to the customer experience! And like you I say it really is that simple :-)

Posted by Trevor Gay at May 7, 2008 3:50 AM

Personalities are very difficult to manage. There can be a sort of rules of engagement, if you will, but the person of authority usually sets these rules that are disseminated in actions and attitude throughout the company.

Posted by Judith Ellis at May 7, 2008 7:37 AM

Trevor...thank you for your kind words and vote of confidence. I appreciate your positive attitude and compassion on this blog.

Posted by Judith Ellis at May 7, 2008 7:56 AM

I LOVE the Michelangelo quote. My aim is ALWAYS high, though I sometimes fail. Here's a paradox: the more you fail the less of it you do. TP's daily quote today reads: "Test fast, fail fast, adjust fast."

Posted by Judith Ellis at May 7, 2008 8:07 AM

I, too, like to aim high; I always shoot for 100% (haven't reached it yet, of course.)

best price on viagra with prescription This means that, in order to work in a 100% jerk-free environment, I've been self-employed for quite some time. My only co-worker is my wife, and we each keep an eye on the other 50% of the company, making sure we don't see any jerks ;)

I have worked, briefly, for people I could not respect. If my choice is to do the best I can despite them or leave, obviously, I've left.

A manager's personality sets the front line's personality. You will become like the people you work with, given enough time. I won't work with jerks; not as my employer, not as my partner, employee, even client.

Posted by Joel D Canfield at May 7, 2008 10:28 AM

So, Joel, does alienating jerks (are pricks and jerks synonmous terms?) empower them or marginalize them? How do you marginalize a prick in power? Is it possible to truly empower them in a positive way by the work accomplished? (We grow and learn, personally and professionally, through ease and conflict.) I say we work with team members to create solutions to problems, while respecting the prick in power. This is the best isolation.

Posted by Judith Ellis at May 7, 2008 12:53 PM

Trevor...you gave me a reasonable answer to my question if women could be pricks. But while I accepted the dictionay definition given, its typical use is far beyond that and is mainly associated with men, though the attributes of pricks can clearly be aligned with women.

Cathy's comment in the protocal post, where she referred to anatomy, got me to thinking further about my question. Here are a few of Merriam-Webster's Online Dictionary definition of prick:

4. usually vulgar: penis
5. usually vulgar: a spiteful or contemptible man often having some authority

Perhaps these terms are more to the point of the post, though I clearly agree that women in authority can most certainly be spiteful and contemptible.

By adopting the behavior above, associated with men, we make ourselves pricks. Women in this new blazing business marketplace should adopt our own leadership styles.

We must be aware of what we ask for and be conscious of whose lead we follow.

Posted by Judith Ellis at May 7, 2008 1:57 PM

I see, Trevor, that you have added the "woman" bit to the Merriam-Webster Online Dictionary that does not exist. I see also that you did not add the more salient fourth definition which I have included above.

You have edited the content and by doing so stripping it of its powerful meaning which in essence did not answer my question properly. I don't like editing that much; it often manipulates and strips language of its power towards action.

Posted by Judith Ellis at May 7, 2008 2:05 PM

Apologies Judith - the parenthesis (‘women’) was indeed my insert and was not in the dictionary online – I should have made that clear.

how to order viagra online

My observation that woman can be p*****s just as much as men is a subjective view of mine based on experience.

As I’ve stated in the comments on the posting entitled ‘Comments on TP.com’ about the protocol and use of language I repeat that you and I engaged in a discussion about p*****s that was initiated by Tom himself – we were responding. The rules must apply to all of us.

At the risk of incurring the wrath of Cathy I am not going to comment further on this posting. Let’s consider the matter closed :-)

Posted by Trevor Gay at May 7, 2008 4:14 PM

Closed it is, Trevor, perhaps, for now.

Posted by Judith Ellis at May 7, 2008 4:20 PM

Martin- "Flip the funnel around and get the f@$k out of the way. :)"...Abso-freakin-lutely! (brief and hopefully Living Friendly approved). Thanks for sharing the "secret" and the results that prove it!

Posted by Dave Wheeler at May 8, 2008 1:39 AM