Comments

Tom, thanks for reminding us that our value isn't just measured in dollars.

Posted by Mike LaChapelle at January 28, 2010 7:02 PM

"If a man is called to be a street sweeper, he should sweep streets even as Michelangelo painted, or Beethoven composed music, or Shakespeare wrote poetry. He should sweep streets so well that all the hosts of heaven and earth will pause to say, here lived a great street sweeper who did his job well."

--Martin Luther King, Jr.

The value of the work does not necessarily have anything to do with net worth.

Thanks for the post, Tom. It's appreciated.

Posted by Judith Ellis at January 28, 2010 9:10 PM

Tom, thanks for the powerful insight.
"I have held many things in my hands, and I have lost them all; but whatever I have placed in God's hands, that I still possess." Martin Luther

Mr. Winkleried threw off the yoke of voluntary indentured servitude. His riches lie in what he believes.

Posted by Randy Bosch at January 28, 2010 10:33 PM

And it's posts like that Tom, that make this page the first one I turn to every morning. Thanks!

Posted by Brad Hamann at January 29, 2010 9:44 AM

The thing that is really and truly sad is that Fortune would see it as tragic if Mr. Winkelried's decades of hard work would be vaporized but attaches no such import to the work being done by the "ordinary" folks who worked for customers of Lehmans and were laid off when their companies collapsed in the aftermath of Lehman's own collapse.

Perhaps the Fortune guy should try to re-arrange this well known phrase or saying: head, bottom, own, up.

Posted by Mark JF at January 29, 2010 11:18 AM

Perhaps everyone should give this Fortune guy a break. He dashed off a line that he thought sounded good - and he more that likely was working against a deadline.

Posted by zorro at January 29, 2010 11:48 AM

Zorro - Words matter. They even matter more if writing is your profession.

Posted by Judith Ellis at January 29, 2010 1:15 PM

No "dashing off a line" for pros. Judith right. On the other hand I am using Mr. Fortune as a metaphor to some extent--I fear there are a lot of people who would have written that line sans irony.

Posted by tom peters at January 29, 2010 2:07 PM

I agree, Tom, and appreciate your distinction. I actually got the metaphor bit and thought it quite clever. I noticed right away that the writer's name was substituted for the Fortune guy and now Mr. Fortune. That's better still. :-) I also thought that Mr. Fortune's line was well-written with a "dash" of irony. There is the essence of the intended words to consider and there is often the sheer brilliance of a line. The brilliance makes the essence of a line clearly known. But they are not necessarily one and the same. There are many bad writers with great ideas. In any regard, both essence and brilliance in writing require thought and not mere dashing off. Professional writers know this.

Posted by Judith Ellis at January 29, 2010 2:34 PM

A writer has a critical duty - to communicate clearly. Yes, we all fall short of that goal too often.

Richard Saul Wurman's approach is worth consideration: "I describe the ability to communicate as being able to understand what it is like not to understand. And in order to pass a piece of information to somebody else I have to understand what it is like not to understand that piece of information."
(Educom Review, Nov/Dec 1997).

Posted by Randy Bosch at January 29, 2010 5:25 PM

"No "dashing off a line" for pros. "

And Payton Manning never throws an interception.
You've got to be frigging kidding me!
Also, decades of hard work would have gone up in smoke -
unless you are willing to argue that making money was just
a - 'nice to have' - the guy was doing wonderful work for the world and he just 'happened' to make a forture.

Posted by zorro at January 29, 2010 7:04 PM

Zorro - Your analogy is just a tad bit off as writers of Fortune are not writing in real time the way Manning would be throwing a pass that's intercepted. Articles are presented to an editor and perhaps sent back to the writer and then published. Manning is looking at all of the possible open offensive players, throws the pass and gets picked off in real time during a say a Super bowl. The analogy would have worked better if Mr. Fortune was tweeting and perhaps the Goldman guy jumped in with a quick rebuttal. But even then there is not a real interception; it’s a rebuttal. I smiled at your concluding comment. When I read the post I was reminded that Goldman Sachs is doing "God's work." This being so that net worth would be by far less than the "'net contributor cost' to our collective well being." :-) But I wholeheartedly agree that "the worker deserves his wages" whether they're building a car or creating investment vehicles, needless to say the deserving bit is quite questionable for some.

Posted by Judith Ellis at January 29, 2010 10:51 PM

This is all very silly.
This is what you see in what the guy wrote. It is far from factual. He did not say the man's life would have been wasted. Its you guys who are equating what a man does for a living with what a man is. Some would consider that to be superficial. The writer said that many years of work would have disappeared. This is absolutely true.
If someone spent 20 years carving a beautiful sculpture into the side of a mountain and it was suddenly destroyed in an earth quake, 20 years of work would have evaporated. Would the mans life have been wasted?
That is an open question. The fact that this reminds you of the Goldman Sacks story is an interpretation, not a fact.

My interpretation is that this post is nothing more that a way of looking down on someone. But I admit that it is my interpretation.

Posted by zorro at January 30, 2010 9:39 AM

"(Hmmmmm. How can the middle class shrink? Wages may be stagnant, but the middle is the middle is the middle--wages, ages, etc. Percentile 20 to 80 or some such.)"

This is response from tom to a frank rich article I posted.
Frank Rich was pointing out that the middle class is shrinking.
My interpretation of Tom's words is that he could give a rat ass about the middle class.
Or, how about its just Tom's way of saying 'let them eat cake'.

Posted by zorro at January 30, 2010 10:00 AM

Randy, love the RSW!!!!!

Posted by tom peters at January 30, 2010 12:34 PM

Zorro says what is "very silly" and then preceeds to adds his two more cents to a already silly discussion. He then commits exactly what he accusses others of: giving his interpretation of lines that that another has written.To others his intetpretation of Tom's lines may be very silly. What IS way silly is that Zorro often arises or should I say elevates himself to be the judge and jury of the thoughts and intentions of others, especially those who are published authors, haranging them at every turn while to my knowledge he has not published anything, never equating himself to have expert knowledge or experience on anything so as not to be called out on anything while forcefully giving relentless opinions and versions of the same thing. He says the same things again and again. But I have appreciated many of his published blog comments and he is a good researcher. Anyway, silly is as silly does. The only problem is that silliness is determined by the reader. The same is true of content.

Posted by Judith Ellis at January 30, 2010 3:31 PM

I noted that what I said was an interpretation.
And I have a difficult time seeing anything positive in toms quote - why wan't he held to the same stanad as the fortune guy? I think toms quote is much more telling as to what tom things of the middle class than what the forture guy consdiers as and important life.

That fact that Tom has published something is the problem.
People seem to cling to every word he utters merely because he is a published author.

I realized the futility of disagreeing with someone on his very own fansite.
Because this site is after all, just a fansite for a celebrity author.

Marchel Ducamp made the point years ago that if you put a urinal on display in a famous art museum, it becomes art.
The same sort of thing takes place here all the time.

Posted by zorro at January 30, 2010 3:47 PM

Thanks, Tom. RSW's multi-faceted education (and, humbly, particularly that in problem recognition and solution process as an Architect) clearly led (and still leads!)to great innovations in communications!

Posted by Randy Bosch at January 30, 2010 4:21 PM

"Marchel Ducamp made the point years ago that if you put a urinal on display in a famous art museum, it becomes art.
The same sort of thing takes place here all the time."

Zorro - Your art work here has been great! I guess I should simply ignore you when you're on such kicks as often your rants subside. But what is for certain is that you can't seem to stop popping in. You visit as often as I. This is good because I would miss you otherwise. :-)

Posted by Judith Ellis at January 30, 2010 6:08 PM

What is your interpretation of Toms quote?

150 mg viagra

It is accurate. It was how he responded to Frank Rich.

Posted by zorro at January 30, 2010 8:47 PM

Zorro - I remember the comment, but I'm not remembering the exact context. This being so let me say that I agree with you that the middle class is shrinking as manufacturing decreases. If you think about age with the advent of penicillin, the middle changed drastically. People lived longer. But I would like to get a further explanation from Tom. Regarding your art work, your aim remains high. :-)

Posted by Judith Ellis at January 31, 2010 1:07 PM

Descriptions of statistical areas like 'middle' are relative terms. Their absolute values may change. The wages for someone in the middle class in 1960 and 2010 will be vastly different but they are still considered middle. An old, improborabale, but good example of perspective is leftover from the Cold War days. The story goes that the US and Russia decided to have a single track event between only their two countries. Just for bragging rights. At the tape the US runner was first across. The US media played up the win with headlines of 'US Wins Race'. The equally adept Rusian spin masters had headlines of 'Russian runner second. US finishes next to last'.
So in the Forutne we have some ambiguitity as to net worth or net financial worth. Since it was Fortune, they would have a bias toward net financial worth, but could have been more clear if you happen to be feeling introspective.

Posted by MikeC at February 1, 2010 12:16 PM

Mike, I think you're onto something. We shouldn't be satisfied until EVERYONE is above average in income.

Posted by John O'Leary at February 1, 2010 2:54 PM

The middle class shrinking thing - Tom was pointing out that
middle class is a salary range and therefore the middle class can't shrink.There will always be a salary range in the middle. But i the middle class is thought of (which it usually is) as a family unit that has health care, a car, a house and the ability to send their kids to college and the ability to retire. And this is attainable with 40 hours work a week.
It also includes financial stability and a yearly paid vacation.
This is class of people that is shrinking.
And as for everybody being above average,
I see this as being as absurd as everyone being unique and having their very own marketable talent than no one else has. This is a notion Tom seems to believe in.

Posted by zorro at February 1, 2010 5:04 PM

I have no idea what Tom Peters business experience is. He never shares it with us. It tells us what he reads or who he has talked to, but what are his actual experiences and why do they give him any wisdom?
What am I getting at? Watch this Sienfeld clip .
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z2CTihQy_XE

Posted by zorro at February 1, 2010 5:25 PM

Well, we shouldn't tolerate having half the people below average in anything. Especially math.

According to one report 4 out of 3 Americans can't do fractions.

Posted by John O'Leary at February 1, 2010 9:40 PM

Actually, it is very possible to have 90% of people below average.

1 + 1 + 1 + 1 + 1 + 1 + 1 + 1 + 1 + 100
110/10= 11.

90% are below average in this case. Which as far as income goes is exactly where we are headed. cheap wholesale viagra

Posted by zorro at February 1, 2010 9:56 PM

actually, the sum above is 109.

109/10=10.9 which still leaves 90% below average.

Posted by zorro at February 1, 2010 10:00 PM

This is it! I was looking for article like this one couse I need it for my home work.

Posted by Vedezevanje at February 7, 2010 2:28 PM